Guide to capitol ship combat (long)

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bleh
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Guide to capitol ship combat (long)

Post by bleh » Fri, 26. Mar 04, 18:59

So you have all the cash in hand finally to buy the ship of all ships, the killer of the galaxy, the M2. Ever wondered what to do with your cash? Ever wondered what to do with that M2 once you have it? Well read on. This is the basic guide to M2 use and combat.

We all know that you can take down a Xenon K with an M6 or even an M3, this can be fun but it can also be fun to take down the Xenon K with an M2. Proper capitol ship combat is more about timing and angle than the skills you need with smaller craft.

Lesson 1: which M2 to buy?

Well the answer is a varied one and much discussed on this board. Basically it boils down to taste and what weapon you want to use. Only 2 weapons count to be used on capitol ships: GPSG and GPPC. These are the biggest and best turret weapons you can get. The GHEPT is there only for the poor turrets that cant fit one of the other two.

If you want to shred into bases (pirate or otherwise) then GPSG is it, that limits your choice to the Paranid Odyseus since it’s the only M2 that can mount those beasties. If you want to shred other capitol ships (Xenon K) then anything that can mount the most GPPCs that can fire FORWARD the better. This means that you can have almost anything (including the Odyseus ;). Basically most people agree that the Odyseus is the best all round.

Lesson 2: weapons load out.

As discussed before the weapons are limited to GPPC and GPSG. You should keep one important rule in mind: GPSG is good ONLY when you don’t want to make enemies other than the target you are shooting at, it is an area of effect and hits everything in the “wash”. So the best all round loadout is: Paranid Odyseus with GPPC for all the turrets that can hold em (Front, Left and Right) and GHEPTS for the turrets that cant (top, bottom and back). Keep 6 GPSGs in the cargo hold for the left and right turrets when taking on Xenon capitol ships when no one else is around.

Lesson 3: combat rating

As most people will tell you shooting small things (anything smaller than M2) from inside an M2 is EASY! No aiming is needed and your turrets will earn you combat rating points in no time flat. Just make sure that you set your turrets to Attack Enemies, more on this in the next lesson.


Lesson 4: using your turrets

Since an M2 does not have guns that you can aim by steering the ship you have to shift your mind away from the methods used to shoot in smaller ships. This is VERY important! As of patch 1.3 the turrets actually shoot and hit things.
To use the turrets follow these steps:
a. Press shift-c
b. Use the down arrow key to scroll to where the turrets configurations are (no hotkey here sadly)
c. Select a turret and a menu will come up
d. Choose the option you want and there you go!

There are 3 basic situations that change the configuration of your turrets:

1. Parking and shooting at lots of little ships: this is when you want to shoot at many little ships and get good combat rating. DON’T try and fly after the little buggers! It’s an exercise in futility. Fly the M2 up to a group of little ships and set all your turrets to fire on enemies. Soon things will start exploding and they will come to you. Zero your speed, hit F2 and use the numpad keys to watch the carnage. DON’T use GPSGs for this if there are any friendlies around.
2. Parking outside a pirate base: this is when you fly up to a pirate base with music from JAWS or Empire Strikes Back playing in the background. You park your M2 about 1.6km from the base. Set all your turrets except your front turret to shoot at enemies, set your front turret to shoot at your target. Select the base as your target and proceed to tickle it into releasing swarms of combat rating providing targets. Hit F2 again and watch the flies hit the GPSG screen. DON’T kill the base! You get no rating for it and if you leave it be for a few days it will make more willing victims for you to fry. Use GPSGs to kill the flies and GPPCs to tickle the nest.
3. Taking on the Xenon K: this is where the M2 really becomes fun to play. Using your M2 to kill a Xenon K is tactically fun and rewarding and can be dangerous where the other uses for the M2 wasn’t! The debate will rage on and on about this but my opinion is to use the Odyseus for this job, put GPSGs on the left and right and GPPC in front. This is important: set the FRONT, LEFT and RIGHT turrets to fire on your target and the rest on the enemy. When zoning into a Xenon sector there could be 2 Ks waiting for you, in which case you can choose to live on the edge or jump out. The basics of combat is: try to achieve such an angle and for the longest possible time so that 2 or 3 of your turrets can pound away at the Xenon before you die.

Moving the M2 around in combat:

Remember that the M2 CANNOT turn on a dime! Its very slow to turn and maneuver. Here is a very good tip though:
The M2 turns from left to right MUCH faster than up and down. This means that if you have to turn the ship up and down it would be MUCH faster to use the Q and W keys to roll the M2 and then turn left and right.

There are 3 basic situations that the K can be in for you:
a. Coming at you: if the K is coming at you play chicken with it, it WILL turn at about 4-6km away. Decrease your speed A LOT and turn WITH it, this means turn so what you go parallel with it. Decrease your speed to stay level with the Xenon. This is where the timing comes in. Your front turret should start pounding away at shields at about 5km and when you turn at the RIGHT time, your side guns (left or right) will “wash” the Xenon with force, keep level and within seconds the Xenon explodes into glory!
b. Flying away from you: if you have a Odyseus then you have to keep on its tail since it will be faster than you, at some point it will turn and then you use the same tactic as above. If you have a faster ship (Ray) then you can slowly increase your speed until you are in firing range and then angle slightly so that your left or right turrets start tearing into it as well.
c. Side on at rest or flying slowly: if the Xenon is lying there across your screen then charge it and drop your speed as soon as your front turrets start firing. Watch which way it turns and accelerates and repeat the head on turning move.

I hope this helps all those wanting to or those that feel like using an M2 to kill stuff!

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CGrand
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Post by CGrand » Fri, 26. Mar 04, 19:10

A good guide i'm impressed

An aditoanl tip for those who think the odessus is ugly and still want to take out Ks

I use the Phoenix (slow i know), but if you fly so that the K is above you about 30 degrees and slight to one side left or right, that means 3 of your turrets can hit it at once,

dead zenon K in no time

I did take out 3 Ks at oncce using this method, altough the last one was a little er hairy and it cost me a alarming sheild critial peice

most important bit of advice

From above actually but just to add to it, use the old navy guide, the goal with capital ships is not to avoid their fire, which is nigh on impossible but to get into position so that the max number of your guns can fire and the min number of theirs can fire at you

this unfortnatly varys from ship to ship
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Post by High_Pinger » Fri, 26. Mar 04, 19:37

Basically use the same tactics against khaak destroyers with one important rule, do not slow down when attacking one head on, khaak ships have a much longer range than you do and will fry most of your shields before you get in range.
For similiar reasons never, and i mean never, attack a khaak cruiser that is running away from you or moving away at speed. You will most likely never be able to catch up and get your weapons into range, and all the while it will be firing its beams at you and turning your ship into debris.

The weakspot on all destroyers is the rear and this is why manouverability is possibly the most important factor in choosing a capital ship, rather than slow down and turn with your enemy, which basically means you will do exactly the same damage to it as it will to you (unless you have gpsg's equipped), keep flying at it till you are slightly behind it and turn very hard aiming your flank and front guns to its rear. This only works against the xenon because the AI will not start turning to face you until it is at least 5 km away. For this reason the Phoenix is the second best of the m2's and definately the best for xenon sectors with a lot of friendlies around.

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JackScratch
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Post by JackScratch » Fri, 26. Mar 04, 19:48

While I can see why folks like the Odysseus and it's G-PSGs, I think an interesting thing that most people (including myself for the longest time) don't notice, is that the Argon Titan can actually mount PSGs too.

The Top, bottom and Rear guns can all mount triple A-PSGs which are surprisingly effective at keeping all angles of your ship protected and have very low power drain in comparison to the Gammas. Plus with a little careful maneuvering they can do a pretty meaningful job on Capitol ships and Stations.

I'm almost sorry I invested in the much more expensive (and bulky!) beta PPCs for those locations on my titan. But the PPCs do have their uses in friendly sectors.

Good guide overall though. :)

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Re: Guide to capitol ship combat (long)

Post by RustiSwordz » Fri, 26. Mar 04, 19:52

bleh wrote: Remember that the M2 CANNOT turn on a dime!


Unless you are in a Condor or Pheonix. :D
As most people will tell you shooting small things (anything smaller than M2) from inside an M2 is EASY! No aiming is needed and your turrets will earn you combat rating points in no time flat. Just make sure that you set your turrets to Attack Enemies, more on this in the next lesson.


Incorrect: Set weapons to Missile Defence and turrets will take out any missiles and will still engage fighters when in range.
Parking outside a pirate base: DON’T kill the base! You get no rating for it and if you leave it be for a few days it will make more willing victims for you to fry.
Incorrect: i got a 5% increase in Admiral rank when i nuked the Brennans Triumph Pirate Base.
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bor...ing
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Post by bor...ing » Fri, 26. Mar 04, 19:59

why is every1 so obsessed with the titan. i got the ray instead
faster, more docking bays, much cheaper, same weapon loadout (less apsg's),same shileding, looks really cool

only thing the nova beats it in is turning and who needs this in a m2
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High_Pinger
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Post by High_Pinger » Fri, 26. Mar 04, 20:03

umm yeah but a nova's an m3 lol

no i see what your getting at but turning is definately the most important factor in capital ship combat and thats why the Titan costs more.

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JackScratch
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Post by JackScratch » Fri, 26. Mar 04, 20:06

The main (really only) problem with the ray is the tiny cargo bay which gets eaten up by the weight of it's guns. That leaves little left for powering the jumpdrive or missiles.

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Post by Paris_Hilton » Fri, 26. Mar 04, 20:53

JackScratch wrote:While I can see why folks like the Odysseus and it's G-PSGs, I think an interesting thing that most people (including myself for the longest time) don't notice, is that the Argon Titan can actually mount PSGs too.
I just found this out after reading your post! :o

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Re: Guide to capitol ship combat (long)

Post by cynric » Fri, 26. Mar 04, 21:25

RustiSwordz wrote:
As most people will tell you shooting small things (anything smaller than M2) from inside an M2 is EASY! No aiming is needed and your turrets will earn you combat rating points in no time flat. Just make sure that you set your turrets to Attack Enemies, more on this in the next lesson.


Incorrect: Set weapons to Missile Defence and turrets will take out any missiles and will still engage fighters when in range.
only when those fighters shoot at you first

missile defense was changed in patch 1.3, it's like protect ship now when there are no missiles aproaching, not attack all enemies (like in previous versions of the game)

unless your ship is on "attack all enemies" command

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XU Vagabond
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Post by XU Vagabond » Fri, 26. Mar 04, 21:27

i love my Titans because it levels any thing in range

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Post by simonnance » Sat, 27. Mar 04, 02:05

anyone tried a ion d and ppc combo, the ions to take down the sheilds and the ppcs to slag the m2. or you could have all ion on the front and ram the sucker once the sheilds are down. btw i dont actualy have a m2, im working my way up tho, 3 m6s and counting. anyone think the titan looks...dodgy :wink: . try flying one into one of the tunnels of a large asteroid :D
i want a xenon k, fast as a spacefly on space weed and mauverable to boot!

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Post by NGR » Sat, 27. Mar 04, 02:24

It seems to me that the M2 class ship is basically a waste of money unless you are taking on Khaak capital ships. Everything else can easily be handled with an M6 (the Nemesis is my favourite). The Nemesis mounts PSG's and enough shielding to be invulnerable against anything except the capital ships and its a walk over to clear all the Xenon sectors in such a ship.

I intend to get an M2 eventually to take on the Khaak sectors but in the meantime the Nemesis is more than satisfactory to meet my destructive needs.

Andyf
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Post by Andyf » Sat, 27. Mar 04, 02:31

yeah, but half of it is just owning one. I mean i dont really have a plan for a fleet, other than sit around feeling chuffed.

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Post by Wolvan » Sat, 27. Mar 04, 02:33

"The Nemesis mounts PSG's and enough shielding to be invulnerable against anything except the capital ships and its a walk over to clear all the Xenon sectors in such a ship."

That may be well and good for some people.

For me, I have to ask, what fun is there in using PSGs? Fire, strafe, realign, fire, strafe, fire.... Not much thought or skill to PSGing.

Now for me, there's nothing more fun than jumping in a pegasus, flying into 347 and tagging all the Xenon caps with wasps, then have them follow me back to the gate in time to meet my arriving 2x Pythons 2x Rays 1x Condor 1x Titan and about 60 fighters. Real strategic mind bender. Absolutely epic battles. :)

Lots more fun than a perseus with 3 PSGs.


2 cents.

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Post by Paris_Hilton » Sat, 27. Mar 04, 02:38

NGR wrote:It seems to me that the M2 class ship is basically a waste of money unless you are taking on Khaak capital ships. Everything else can easily be handled with an M6 (the Nemesis is my favourite). The Nemesis mounts PSG's and enough shielding to be invulnerable against anything except the capital ships and its a walk over to clear all the Xenon sectors in such a ship.

I intend to get an M2 eventually to take on the Khaak sectors but in the meantime the Nemesis is more than satisfactory to meet my destructive needs.
But by owning it, you'll have sense of achievement 8)

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Re: Guide to capitol ship combat (long)

Post by Creston » Sat, 27. Mar 04, 05:20

bleh wrote:Don't kill the base, you get no rating for it!
Just wanted to correct that, a pirate base will MOST DEFINITELY give you combat rating, it just won't give you any rating with the races. But my combat rating still goes up by about 3% for every pirate base that I nail. (at Combat Ace 2nd grade)

Good guide, too bad I read it after buying my M2 this morning and figuring some things out the hard way :)

My preferred way of nailing Xenon K's, in a Paranid Odysseus with ONLY PPCs mounted (don't use GHEPTS, they're too slow and too limited in range).

Approach head on, aim to the left or right of the K. Roll your slip slighty so that you are at a 45 degree perpendicular angle to it. The K will open fire before you do (grrr), but hopefully your turrets will pick up soon enough. Move slightly inward towards the K, making sure not to hit it.

If you're angled properly, you should now have three sets of turrets firing at the K, your front turrets, your top turrets, and your left or right turrets. Once you're passing the K, the front turrets will stop firing at the rear turrets will open fire.

Throughout all this, the K will, at most, have one or two sets of turrets firing at you.
As soon as the K passes you completely, turn after it, making sure to stay at that perpendicular angle, so three sets of your turrets will keep firing. When you cross the back of the K, it will only fire with one turret at you, meaning you should be pretty safe.

Depending on the K's speed, one of two things will now happen.

1) The K will speed away, outrunning you, and recharge its shields before you can take it down. This is annoying, but simply repeat the above.

2) You will turn around behind the K, and come up from its other side, still able to keep your three turrets on it. By the time you come about broadside, and the K starts hitting you with multiple turrets again, you should have it almost killed, and there should be no more danger.

Alternatively, mount a single GPSG, and watch the K whither away before you've gotten 20% shield damage. But don't do this while you're in any sector beside a Xenon (nobody cares about collateral damage there).

It's quite fun to do some capship battle, even if over way too fast. Most Xenon Ks die within about 20-30 seconds...

Creston

bleh
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Post by bleh » Sat, 27. Mar 04, 08:16

Agreed, the pirate bases give you combat rating, I would still leave them alone though, the fighters inside respawn quicker than the base itself so leaving it makes for good sense.

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Sandalpocalypse
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Post by Sandalpocalypse » Sat, 27. Mar 04, 10:37

side note, the APSG has something like 1/8 or 1/16th the damage of the GPSG, silly isn't it?

unless they've changed that in a patch since 1.1, anyways.

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Re: Guide to capitol ship combat (long)

Post by x2newbie1 » Sat, 27. Mar 04, 17:01

bleh wrote:Only 2 weapons count to be used on capitol ships: GPSG and GPPC. These are the biggest and best turret weapons you can get. The GHEPT is there only for the poor turrets that cant fit one of the other two.
I don't own any high-end ships yet, so I've never used PPC. But I'm curious why GPPC is better than GHEPT.
According to Argonpedia :
1) GPPC does 2500 shield and 2000 hull damage
2) GEHPT does 3000 shield and 2000 hull damage

So why is GPPC better?

And what's even more confusing is that it lists :
3) GPSG does 1000 shield and 90 hull damage

So why is GPSG better?

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